The Giants hopes of dramatically altering the balance of power in the NL West took a severe downward turn today as first Shohei Ohtani decided to sign with the Angels, and as Vin Scully would say, "go figure!" Then, late in the day, the Giants threw in the towel on the Giancarlo Stanton trade and announced that he refused to waive his no-trade clause to clear the way for the trade Larry Baer and Giants management wanted so badly.
Ohtani wants to both pitch and hit. The easier route to that goal is to play for a team that uses the DH, which effectively narrowed his reasonable choices to the Mariners, Angels and Rangers. Ohtani said he "felt a strong connection with the Angels." I don't know how to even begin commenting on THAT! Apparently Arte Moreno can be a pretty sweet guy when he wants to be as he's pulled off more than a few of these dark horse deals. At any rate, it will be fascinating to see how Ohtani develops as a major leaguer. Wish him the best since he won't be doing it for the Dodgers or Padres.
It's a bit tough to figure out what's going on with Stanton. Does he want to be baseball's version of Kevin Durant signing with the Warriors and only consider teams that already have overwhelming talent? Is he so ticked off at the Marlins, he's hell-bent on frustrating them any way he can? "So, you think tanking the team around me is going to force me out? OK, you can just go ahead and tank the team for 10 years. See how THAT makes it profitable!" I mean, I wouldn't blame him a bit if he did that. Does he really think the Giants are in such terrible shape they won't be winners again in the next 10 years, even with him on the roster? Is he intimidated by AT&T Park? Whatever the reason, the Giants have to now cross their fingers that if he gets traded, it won't be to the Dodgers.
So, now the Giants have to wake up from their little reverie into fantasyland and get to work on a real offseason plan. I hope they don't rebound into an expensive and bad relationship with a lesser player than Giancarlo Stanton. I'm A-OK with adding a complementary player or two, working on getting kids like Arroyo, Duggar and Tyler Beede up to speed. And by all means, hold onto Heliot Ramos! Sometimes the best trades are the ones that are not made. Stanton would have brought a ton of risk with his promise of transformation.
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Stanton may well have thought that forthe Giants to afford him, they would have made it too hard financially for them to solve their problems well enough to be winners. This might well have been true. I’m not unhappy that this deal failed, though I now shall resent Stanton despite my thinking that he acted rationally and my being relieved that the Giants, after disastrous 2017, have avoided “a ton of risk.” I look forward to the team’s coming up with less flamboyant and more diverse solutions.
ReplyDeleteIf the Marlins can’t move Stanton, might they move Ozuna, whose arb results this year should make him plenty costly, for some of the orospects the Giants were willing to surrender for Stanton? They did threaten to sell off some of their supporting cast, if Stanton balked at going, both to shed salary money and to make staying less agreeable for him. Ozuna plus a nimble CF and a worthy third baseman might bring nearly as many WAR to the Giants as Stanton, with lots less eclat but also less risk and outlay.
Hey folks, after this world win of missing out, I believe the Giants need to do a full blown rebuild, and savage the last few years of Posey's career. I mean we keep losing possible top notch talent to lesser teams. Really, we lose otanhi,to the Angeles. What have the Angeles accomplished with trout and Albert P. I think that the Giants really need to elevate their public image and there farm team, I really believe that this is a very important off-season for Evans. They really need to hit on that #2 pick in June to pear with ramos for the future. Blog, your thoughts.
ReplyDeleteOK - trade Samardjiza for Domingo Santana in RF, Strickland for Jackie Bradley in CF. Platoon Pence/Span in LF. Longoria or Frazier 3B. Pickup Hundley again, promote Beede and Suarez for the bullpen and play ball and win in 2018! Play all those rookies in AAA (Shaw, Arroyo, Slater, Duggar, Jones, Ramos) until they are red hot for the majors - draft well next year and stock up AA - Righetti will organize those pitcher picks. Come on, Bobby!
ReplyDeleteThe four teams that are, reportedly, on the list are all the teams most likely to make it to the World Series -- Astros, Cubs, Dodgers and the Yankees. So, yes, Kevin Durant.
ReplyDeleteA sad, but necessary wake-up call. The roster is a mess, and it will only get better with a long term plan. Any signings/trades aimed at contending in 2018 will only set the franchise back.
ReplyDeleteBite the bullet guys, and accept that taking one step back now could well save the Giants from many years of frustration.
The Giants are where they are when the off season began.
ReplyDeleteIt didn't seem so bad before the Stanton-Ohtani saga, it isn't now.
The fear, of course, is Stanton goes to the other LA team, then we might be thinking in terms of going young, trading off older expensive pieces if future value can be received, and building the winner like 2010-2016 (first half,anyway).
The "irrational exuberance" surrounding Stanton hid the dark reality of CB hell -- it was doubling down on one guy the bet to "win now" made with Samardzija, Cueto, Melancon, Span, and the contracts for Belt and Crawford.
The good news is that bet could still pay off without owning the biggest, brightest toy of the moment the cost of which will go on forever.
I like building a winner, which the Giants have done, rather than buying a winner which, as we know too well, is high risk for maybe high reward.
Span is a special case in the list above. For one thing, there is just one year of that left and with a credible "go-get-the-ball" CFer maybe batting 8, a platoon in LF of Span and Pence (as the 4th OFer) won't be even Giancarlo light, but could hit 25 HRs and field credibly. 25 more from Parker, a healthy Belt, and better gods can make the playoffs where, with a closer, anything can happen.
Go Giants!
Hey blog, just like that. The Yankees, have agreed to a Stanton trade. As, usuall the Giants got played. The Giants, need to start the rebuild now. Blog, your thoughts.
ReplyDeleteLike any other team that suffers an off year dues to injuries > Belt /Bum/Cueto/Arroyo/Slatter! Lets be a wee bit more rationale. A rotation healthy Matt Moore "pitcher whispered" > Stratton / Blach / Beede. Duggar given a good look see,Parker /Mac /Pence/Span and mystery signing of a reliever or2 another outfielder. Healthy Posey/Craw/ and boy I am glad Panik was not traded. We are still very much a team that can really compete.
DeleteRichard in Winnipeg
Melancon issues hurt as much as anyone after Bumgarner.
DeleteWith Posey second high on the teams in games played -- Crawford "only" missed 18 games! -- the trainers were busy.
Even Bochy missed some games, didn't he?
Just 2.7 wins in 5 games will usually get you in the playoffs (2.3 in 5 would have gotten you in last place in 2 of MLB's divisions): the margin is thin.
54% is something you can do with a better than average team. Once in the playoffs, even a 5 seed can win.
For the Giants case, getting from 64 wins to 87 is just reversing what happened last year.
Possible with a healthy team.
That's the crux! Patch a few holes and put everyone on HGH.
It's time to prove Stanton wrong and show him we can be winners. Ridiculous now he's in NY the furthest he can ever be from the west coast....
ReplyDeleteIt wasn't about the coast. It was about best opportunities to get to the WS. Hence the Dodgers, Astros, Cubs & Yankees -- the top-4 teams in MLB.
DeleteMaybe I'm barking up the wrong tree here, but this strikes me as being more than just a whiff of anticompetitiveness here. It's one thing to have market and payroll diversity. It's quite another to have a team do a complete teardown then have the best player dictate that he can only go to a few teams that already have the best talent. What's the point of having a CBA, Draft, Bonus pools, CBT's and all if you are going to allow a trade like this to occur?
DeleteThe Stanton saga is strong evidence of a need for a payroll floor in baseball. If you can't maintain a competitive payroll, then maybe you should not be an owner in the league?
It makes sense but you can't argue that this is the new framework for building a world series competitor. Suck for 5-10 years until you have accumulated enough affordable talent that all peaks at the same time. It has worked pretty well for the last 3 world series winners! If you have a long term plan, this is the fastest way and gives you the best chance to get there.
DeleteThe Giants have won 3 world series with mostly talent that they drafted through hard to watch years after 2003. They tried to give the impression that they were trying to be competitive throughout the entire time but they were still awful and hard to watch. That is what we have to look forward to over the next 4-5 years or more depending on how Evans and Sabes play things this year. The tear down and build up method might be the best chance the Giants have to build a team that can compete in 2020 when all those young prospects you mention are coming up.
i think a salary cap will be the parameters of the next cba and i wouldn't be surprised to see a lockout in 2021 if they players don't agree to a salary cap
DeleteThe problem is if it works for a couple of teams, all of a sudden everbody is trying to do it. Last year at least half of NL teams were non-competitive, several of them intentionally so. I guess we'll know it worked if in 5 years, 4-5 of those teams are in the postseason and the Dodgers and Cubs are in the cellar.
Deleteim confused. are the haloes guaranteeing that ohtani will be their everyday dh? as for stanton, i think that the trade proves more that he is more interested in personal stats than the ring. yanks had plenty of offense last season and still didnt make it to the ship. power hitters do not want to come to att...its as simple as that. and i still believe that it was players, not the ball, that was juiced.
ReplyDeletebacci
Was Boston not interested? The Red Sox were as good as the Yankees last year and think about Stanton and his popups to left! He played 3 game in Fenway (2012), 9 ABs, SSS: 1 HR.
ReplyDeleteStanton is A-Rod 2.0. Move on. Glad he's not a Giant, even happier he's not a Dodger.
ReplyDeleteWow, pick your top 4 (?) teams and go to one of them?
ReplyDeleteThe record of the top 4 teams making the WS the next year is pretty dismal.
Winners don't repeats!
That criteria works fine if yo pick the Patriots or th Warriors, but not in the MLB.
Yes, Stanton could help a winner repeat, but winning costs so much payroll money, the luck of getting through the playoffs is brutal, and players don't maintain from year to year.
Only 4 teams this century have made it back to the WS, and only 1 won the second year! 1 in 18!
Good luck Stanton, but you could be the difference maker.
Help Houston repeat? Don't think they'll pay enough to make Miami happy.
Help the Dodgers over the hump? They're doing what they can to get out of CB hell, is this what they need to double down?
Cubs, Cleveland? Not happening.
Yankees? They weren't in last year, will they double down on payroll when they're getting there without it?
KC, Mets?
The Giants were rebuffed and apparently the Red Sox although I think Boston would be the most likely to benefit. Are they in consideration?