In the future, when we look back on this Giants baseball season, it may well be that we will say the moment that sealed the Giants fate was the hanging slider that Sergio Romo threw to AJ Ellis with 2 outs and the bases loaded in the top of the 9'th inning of today's game. The Giants had battled their arch-nemesis, Clayton Kershaw to a draw for 8 innings. Last year, Romo would have struck Ellis out to get out of the inning and the Giants would have scratched out the winning run in the bottom of the 9'th. This year, he gives up the winning run plus 2 insurance runs, and let the opportunity to take down Kershaw slip away. That is a microcosm of the season so far. Key Lines:
Giants Offense- 4 hits, 1 walk. Lone run scored on double by Quiroz and eventual SF by Torres.
Chad Gaudin- 7 IP, 4 H, 1 R, 1 BB, 9 K's. ERA= 2.44. What an effort by Gaudin! Right now, he might be the #2 starter on the staff! Another dumpster dive success story for Brian Sabean. Too bad it's probably not going to be enough to turn this season around, but hey, stick around next year like Vogie did after 2011 and you might get to win a postseason game or 2, Chad!
The Loss drops the Giants deeper into 4'th place, 6.5 games behind the NL West leading Dangerous D'Backs who, once again, clobbered the Reeling Rockies 6-1. The Dodgers remain 4.5 games back but took over sole possession of 2'nd place as the Rockies slipped to 3'rd, 5.5 games behind. The Pathetic Padres dropped 7.5 games behind with an 11-7 loss to the Nationals.
The Mets now come to AT&T Park with Matt Harvey facing Tim Lincecum. Anyone think I should keep Harvey on my fantasy team bench for this one?
The Dodgers go to Arizona for a showdown at high noon at the OK Corral with the Dangerous Ones.
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MIke Kickham got sent back to Fresno to make room on the roster for Gaudin. Somewhat lost in the chaos of Friday's blowout, Kickham had a pretty good appearance: 3 IP, 4 H, 2 R, 1 BB, 5 K's. That's progress and a very nice K/BB.
ReplyDeleteBochy told him he had shown progress and gave him specific things to work on in Fresno. There is talk of moving him to the bullpen down there. I would not want to see that. The Giants may well need SP's next year and Kicks and Surkamp are the two main candidates to be ready by then. Moving him to the bullpen in the future is no big deal compared to moving him back to the rotation.
Gaudin pitched great today. Its a shame he didn't get a W. Like you said, Romo would have K'd Ellis last season.
DeleteWhen will the middle of the lineup snap out of their funk?
They may need SP next year, but Bochy has said that they like Kickham pitching better out of the bullpen. Maybe he can develop into another Jeremy Affeldt who started out his minor league career as a starting pitcher with the Royals.
I think they should let Timmy & Zito walk if they don't improve their performances especially on the road. We'll see about Vogie when he comes back. If they choose not to bring them back, they are going to have a lot of $$ to spend in either the free agent or trade markets to improve their starting pitching and maybe other parts of the 2014 team.
LG
I think that what Bochy is saying about Kickham only applies to this season, at this particular point of his development. I think the equivalent situation is when they brought up Sanchez, he wasn't ready to start, so they used him in relief, until they thought he was ready enough. I think they will do the same with Kickham, they've determined that he's not ready to start now, but can be a useful reliever (that could be a sign that the Giants might be thinking of trading off some lefty reliever to pick up prospects, and use Kickham in relief to get him ready to start in majors next season).
DeleteI think Zito will be Zito, up and down, up again sometime later this season.
Unlike most Giants fans, I would still like to see Lincecum come back to us, of course, though, at a reasonable contract given how poorly he has pitched the past two seasons. I think that he can be shifted to, for lack of a better term, super-reliever.
He has shown that he can warm up in a moment's notice, plus come back from pitching sooner than most pitchers. I would like to see the Giants use him in a role that sabers would love: when the game reaches a high leverage point. If the starter doesn't have it, Lincecum would come in early in the game and bridge to the setup guys if the game is close, eat a few innings if not. He could pitch set-up and bridge to the closer. But if he already has 2 IP, may as well let him pitch the 9th and get the save, saving Romo's arm for really critical situations. And he would come in whether to start an inning or with runners on.
Seems to me that he's still got the stuff to be the Timmy of old. He just doesn't have the concentration of the Timmy of old, that seems to be the key difference. And results in him thinking too much in key situations when starting and pitching for a long time. But in short stints, he can be as focused as anybody, as he showed in the playoffs last season.
I don't see anybody giving him more than a year contract, so I would like the Giants to outbid the highest bidder to retain Lincecum for another season, even if it were a high amount. But if he has another season like this one, then the Giants could focus 2014 on using him in the super-reliever role and see if he can thrive in that role.
I understand not falling to sentiment. My feeling is that he pitched so well for us previously that we kind of owe it to him, that his surplus value from previously would cover another season, plus I think he's close to reaching such a super-reliever stage of his career, and would rather he be doing it for us rather than, say, the Dodgers.
Gaudin could be worth quite a bit at the deadline. VERY cheap contract, as well as the ability to use him as a starter or long reliever. He could pull a good prospect or two.
ReplyDeletei wonder if the Royals would be a good fit to go get Pablo and Pence from the Giants. It would be neat if the Giants could get Yordano Ventura and Adalberto Mondesi from the Royals, or even some more guys. would be quite the shakeup.
This game was tough, but the Toronto series, to me, was the defining point of the season. Those two games broke the psyche of this club.
ReplyDeleteWell, the Toronto Series was certainly where it all started to fall apart.
DeleteI started Homer Bailey on my fantasy team last week...
ReplyDeleteRight now, any pitcher on your fantasy team that is facing the Giants should absolutely not be on your bench!
DeleteWas it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?
ReplyDeleteNo, but it was over when we took out their fleet at Midway......wait....
DeleteGermans?
ReplyDeleteForget it, he's rolling.
Just when we think we've had enough, here come Harvey and Wheeler!
ReplyDeleteHere's the thing. In 2010 and even last year, we'd have said, "bring 'em on," but now we're cowering in fear.
DeleteRight now, it doesn't matter what pitcher we face. The CY level pitchers show why they are CY level pitchers against us and the scrubs have their best starts of the year against us.
DeleteBelieve me, I'd love to take it to both Harvey and Wheeler, but if we can't even split with the Marlins at home... However, if we're going to even things out, this week is the time to do it.
DeleteIf in fact this team is done and there is no point in continuing to fight for this year then I would like to see management really go for it at the trade deadline and dump anyone and everyone possible. The only reason a lot of these guys are still around is pure nostalgia just like after 2010. The Freddy Sanchez's, Pat Burrells, and Aubrey Huffs have turned into Angel Pagan, Marco Scutaro, and Hunter Pence (not really but you get the idea). The point is that what is the point if we aren't going to win and none of these pieces are part of the "future".
ReplyDeleteThe list of untouchables is pretty short but Cain, Madbum, and Posey are our core and Crawford and Belt don't make any sense to trade right now. Zito, Voggie, Sandoval, Scutaro, and Pagan wouldn't fetch much and even Sandoval who everyone would love to see shipped out isn't going to net us enough in return to make it worthwhile. There are a handful of others in the bullpen and the bench who don't need to be mentioned either as they are for all intensive purposes insignificant.
So what we are left with as far as realistic trade candidates in order of value percieved by me are:
Pence
Timmy
Romo
Gaudin
Lopez
Affeldt
Blanco??
All of these guys have some value and all are either in their last year or are expendable (Lopez would be nice to keep). Selling at the deadline is never a great position to be in for obvious reasons but it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world for a team that hasn't done it in a long long time. I would also look forward to players like Paguero and Pill getting extended shots after the dust settles giving them an opportunity to get a head start on next year. Of the names above, who do you think would be most likely to get traded and did I leave anyone out?
The Giants wont really get that much for any of those guys. Guys like Gaudin, Lincecum, Blanco, Affeldt would fetch you what Cubs got for Feldman (Arrieta and Strop) two guys with ERAs over 5 in majors. Not really something to be WOW about.
DeletePence might be the most interesting due to his power potential but he's a free agent after the season.
I think it's highly unlikely that Pence or Timmy will be back next year, so if the Giants are not going to be buyers, and it certainly looks like they aren't, I'd start with them, if nothing else to save few mil and pay it forward to next year.
DeleteTeams saw the energy Pence brought to SF last year and to Philly the year before that. I think there could be a nice market for him. 3 teams, Pirates, Reds and Tigers could really use another good OF if they are making a run at a championship. I think the Giants could get a nice piece or two for him.
Timmy would be more of a straight salary dump.
Romo definitely has value, especially to a team like Detroit that has a real chance to go all the way, but doesn't really have a closer.
Gaudin also has a significant value due to his success, versatility and low salary.
So yes, Pato. I like your list and pretty much agree with everything you said there.
But DrB, if we were to trade Romo, doesn't make the bullpen even more fishy than it is right now? Also, heading into next year whos the closer or step up?
DeleteIf we were to trade Romo, I would assume will get a prospect who profiles as a closer.
Am I the only one who would still like to see the Giants give Pence another 2 years? I understand that he's our best trade piece, but I just don't see who would make a better RF for us going forward. Pence is an above average player who actually gives max effort all the time (which is rare these days). Who would we replace him with?
DeleteI think most of us would love to get Tim off the payroll, but who would actually want him right now? No way we resign him, but I don't know if the front office is ready to move him in a trade. What are your thoughts?
This organization is definitely in need of some restocking at the double/triple A levels, but I wonder if the fan base is ready to part ways with some of these guys this year. To me, the Giants are at a point where they're going to need to fill roster spots through trades and free agency in the offseason, and buy a little time for Crick, Blackburn etc. to develop. Any start we could get on that process this season would be great (trading for a Bud Norris might help), but I just don't envision many scenarios where that can happen at this point.
Anon,
DeleteI don't see Romo as the long term closer. I would love to see us trade him to Detroit for Bruce Rondon, who is unproven, but has a ceiling as a dominant closer.
Covechatter,
The Giants might have to package a prospect with Timmy to get another team to take him. Not that I expect the Giants to do that!
I would not be against trading 3 prospects for Bud Norris at the same time they are selling guys who won't be here next year.
Now Arias goes down with emergency appendectomy. Not that he is indispensable, but that is pretty much a capsule of the season right there.
DeletePence will be expensive to keep and the Giants might not be willing. If he wants to come back he can always sign back with the Giants after he is traded which I can't remember ever happening... wait I think Sydney Ponson did it once or maybe twice. Timmy I could see getting a return much like what Colorado got for Ubaldo which was not a whole hell of a lot but maybe they get 4 low-mid level prospects and could get lucky with one. Romo is at his peak RIGHT NOW and needs to be dumped before his slider stops sliding. He is basically a knuckleballer up there with his one pitch and if he is off even a little it is good night so let some other team watch him deteriorate. Affeldt wouldn't get us much but he makes 6 million or so and Gaudin has to have value. If they get low level prospects in return for any of those guys it is a win. They could potentially clear 30-40 million which puts them in a nice position next year to sign Robinson Cano!
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