tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post3696598973812791894..comments2024-03-29T02:43:41.299-07:00Comments on When the Giants Come to Town...: Thoughts on Pablo Sandoval: A Prospect and Career RetrospectiveDrBGiantsfanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05574563470247927739noreply@blogger.comBlogger42125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-71676609858304372972014-11-05T18:51:01.544-08:002014-11-05T18:51:01.544-08:00I think Beede might move a lot faster than we imag...I think Beede might move a lot faster than we imagine is possible right now.DrBGiantsfanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10699322384438591979noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-24371804559497833832014-11-05T14:56:06.098-08:002014-11-05T14:56:06.098-08:00I never saw this reported, so this is only my assu...I never saw this reported, so this is only my assumption of what happened, but I think that Pagan and the Giants had an under-the-table agreement. With the Giants not giving him a QO, I think they bought themselves an offer to match any offer he received, but with an additional discount applied (I assumed it was approx. 10%). It was very odd at the time that they did not offer a QO, and when they got him at a relatively decent deal (4/40), I thought SOMETHING like this HAD to be in play.calsnowskierhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02746266404646821133noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-59152174230136934242014-11-05T11:44:31.579-08:002014-11-05T11:44:31.579-08:00I'm sure there are designs on fixing Bede (con...I'm sure there are designs on fixing Bede (control) and getting him on that faster (college pitcher) track to the Majors.<br /><br />Very early returns don't show a quick correct. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-84089809453448140222014-11-05T09:22:09.048-08:002014-11-05T09:22:09.048-08:00Disapointingly, the Giants younger pitching prospe...Disapointingly, the Giants younger pitching prospects seem to have stalled a bit, and at this point there's no guarantee that any of them will be making contributions - either this year or into the future. So, with that in mind, were I the FO, I would look at sewing up the front 3 of the rotation by signing a very solid & durable #2 - Shields, Lester, Liriano??, Scherzer. Yikes - none of those names seem like typical matches for the Giants.<br /><br />Will Cain show up this year with a strong right arm? Will it help the struggles he was having, even at that? Does Kyle Crick even have an MLB starting future? Huge year for that kid. <br /><br />I honestly have no idea what's going to go down this offseason, but I have a feeling that Sabean may look to the trade market before he shells out a massive contract & drops that 1st rounder. <br /><br />(Post Script - Honestly, Blackburn/Blach/Mejia are likely to turn into at least 1 reliable, inning eating 4th/5th starter. That should do well to replace Voggie and act as an upgrade in 2015, but boy did I have higher hopes on the Giants 2014 miL pitching corps.)RainBallhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00725941337502884436noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-59910185690428959482014-11-05T08:52:13.228-08:002014-11-05T08:52:13.228-08:00Intuitively, it makes sense to me to put money int...Intuitively, it makes sense to me to put money into pitching, as I commented yesterday. We will see in due course what direction the Giants choose to take.BuyLowSellLowernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-61892501168302991592014-11-05T07:30:15.372-08:002014-11-05T07:30:15.372-08:00Excellent analysis of the Giants in Fangraphs yest...Excellent analysis of the Giants in Fangraphs yesterday (4 Nov) by Tony Blengino, "How Good Were the 2014 Giants?" By analyzing batting, pitching, and defense through very up-to-date statistical methods, he breaks down the team's areas of success. He also endorses the notion that the Giants need to put their disposable funds into pitching, not Sandoval. I found both the methods of analysis and the conclusions very illuminating.campanarinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-27789571130127717902014-11-04T21:35:00.589-08:002014-11-04T21:35:00.589-08:00Andrew Torres turned down more money to come back ...Andrew Torres turned down more money to come back to the Giants, possibly a foolish decision on his part. I believe Scutaro signed for less than he could have gotten elsewhere. Pagan gave the Giants a chance to match the best offer from somewhere else.<br /><br />I agree with Pato to the extent that I believe in most cases money is the biggest factor in ballplayer's decisions but it is not the only factor and it is not the biggest factor for some players. The Players Association is not standing over the players with a whip telling them they have to choose the highest bidder regardless of personal preferences or non-monetary needs.DrBGiantsfanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10699322384438591979noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-28675970573920109022014-11-04T21:29:45.037-08:002014-11-04T21:29:45.037-08:00Pence could have been a FA in a few days. The sea...Pence could have been a FA in a few days. The season was over. He had no reason to be afraid of a serious injury anymore. You are not suggesting that Hunter Pence was too uninformed to know what is market value was, right? Hunter Pence was, for all practical purposes a FA and he gave the Giants a HUGE hometown discount!DrBGiantsfanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10699322384438591979noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-91988066543391548882014-11-04T21:20:58.513-08:002014-11-04T21:20:58.513-08:00I would say that a player who chooses not even to ...I would say that a player who chooses not even to find out how much the market would bring him, if only to get a higher matching offer from his preferred team, is certainly not behaving in the simply venal way that Pato thinks is universal. And I believe that in the last few years Giants' players have chosen to stay with us rather than get slightly more elsewhere; but I can't give specific examples, so I put this forth hesitantly. Certainly players have made choices based on geography (Carlos Lee comes to mind) or park characteristics (Olerud vetoing the Giants, ditto A. Soriano), so factors other than money affect players' decisions. More important, though, is that history is a pretty fallible guide in individual cases, especially when the affection of fans, the prospect of WS titles, and one's playing environment are factors, as here with Sandoval.<br /><br />Regardless, is the thrust of Pato's comments that we should simply abandon the idea of Sandoval's return? Should we simply make a strong pitch for Headley, say, whom Pato for unspecified reasons doesn't want, on the grounds that the sooner we act to get a third baseman the better? Or is Pato making sure that we don't get our hopes up, because he is solicitous of our feelings when we are let down, as we will be? <br /><br />I find myself in the very odd position, for me, of agreeing with him that the Giants can best direct their care and dollars elsewhere, for an SP and a LF, putting off finding a new 3B for the time being, till sometime in 2015. I'm not sure this has ever happened before.campanarinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-77851142349774665342014-11-04T20:31:33.001-08:002014-11-04T20:31:33.001-08:00He signed the extension before hitting the free ag...He signed the extension before hitting the free agent market if I'm not mistaken which I often am. Jared Weaver was another and MadBum and Cain did it too but they all signed before other teams were able to make bids on them. Nobody can make anybody do anything but the players association will surely make an effort to encourage Panda to go with the highest bidder to help set the market for guys like Headley and others. If for nothing more, Panda is human and anyone with half a brain knows that you take the money now even if it is just 1 million more like Juan Uribe did when he left to go to the dodgers!! There are no loyalties and once a player hits free agency he doesn't come back. Aside from uncoveted players like Voggie last year I can't really think of anyone else who tested the market and turned down bigger money to come back.... ever!! Patonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-77303938085730573922014-11-04T16:21:32.348-08:002014-11-04T16:21:32.348-08:00When there is an influx of pitchers and few proven...When there is an influx of pitchers and few proven hitters, the law of supply and demand implies we find undervalued deals in pitchers.<br /><br />Is that how it will play out? We will have to wait and see.BuyLowSellLowernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-40076253151674946122014-11-04T15:15:49.778-08:002014-11-04T15:15:49.778-08:00This is about as unhinged a comment as I've se...This is about as unhinged a comment as I've seen in awhile. Pato, just a year ago, Hunter Pence gave the Giants a HUGE hometown discount! To think the Player's Association is dictating to players what offers they can accept is the stuff of conspiracy theory enthusiasts. Do players usually take the highest offer regardless of where it came from? Probably, but I am quite sure it is not universally true.DrBGiantsfanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10699322384438591979noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-63867927978214077152014-11-04T13:47:50.353-08:002014-11-04T13:47:50.353-08:00"Why not give him a 5 year deal"? I'..."Why not give him a 5 year deal"? I'm all for it if the price is right... The price is going to be inflated because there is an influx of pitchers on the market and few proven hitters. 5/100mil is probably close to what it would cost... Not sure he hits for enough power for an AL club to jump out of their chairs to sign him to DH towards the end of a contract. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-72367772968542850942014-11-04T12:20:18.907-08:002014-11-04T12:20:18.907-08:00I like it. Back up the Brinks truck with whatever ...I like it. Back up the Brinks truck with whatever prospects the Giants have. Blackburn, Crick, Mejia, + Duvall and I don't if that that's enough.Ryanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08483153782366187271noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-7824886748908585072014-11-04T07:19:27.039-08:002014-11-04T07:19:27.039-08:00I love how everyone talks about Panda's decisi...I love how everyone talks about Panda's decision like it is an actual choice he is going to make! There will be no considering of ANY offers that aren't the highest and everyone should get that one by now. There are no hometown discounts in Free Agency (if they would have extended him at the beginning of the year maybe). The players association will never allow Panda to take less money and I would bet just about anything that the Giants will not be the highest bidder. <br /><br />As for replacing him, I don't mind going with internal options like Duffy, Duval, Arias, and even Buster to see if anyone stands out next season. Headley isn't a good option and niether are Asdrubal or Aramis but if any of those guys slipped through the cracks and could be had on the cheap then maybe. I'm more concerned about getting another starter and a decent LF. <br /><br />The last option that sounds crazy but could be a possibility is Josh Donaldson. Beane and Sabes don't get along as we all know but Beane has never found himself in such a tough spot as he is right now. His farm is depleted and it might be the best chance Sabes has to pry away a nice piece from Billy. Billy will want Crick and probably a few more top prospects but for some reason I could see this working out.Patonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-36341398212014635042014-11-04T07:04:04.026-08:002014-11-04T07:04:04.026-08:00Why nor give him a 5 year deal and, when he gets t...Why nor give him a 5 year deal and, when he gets too fat to be in the field, trade him to an AL club. Giants might have to eat a few bucks, but it's worth it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-32561462666194914272014-11-03T21:49:29.701-08:002014-11-03T21:49:29.701-08:00Once upon a time I got PO'd at the administrat...Once upon a time I got PO'd at the administration of the healthcare facility where I work. I was contacted by the medical director of a competing group and offered a position. Fortunately, some of my concerns were addressed and I ended up staying. In retrospect, leaving for the new job would have been the worst mistake of my life! The grass isn't always greener on the other side of the fence.DrBGiantsfanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10699322384438591979noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-86090046036356390582014-11-03T21:38:34.025-08:002014-11-03T21:38:34.025-08:00Panda isn't playing on a 3 year contract, so k...Panda isn't playing on a 3 year contract, so kiss that idea goodbye. As for the age of Pujols, the point is moot because Sandoval also isn't going to get a 10 year deal. The Giants have plenty of time here. They've extended a QO and can wait to see what the market for Sandoval is. No need to go crazy breaking the bank until we see what numbers in $$$/years teams are talking about. It isn't the end of the world if he leaves, plus we'll get a great draft pick as compensation. <br /><br />Peavy is a goner. He'll be too expensive for the postseason taste he left in our mouths... <br />Romo is long gone. I'll wish him well, but that frisbee is slowly flattening out.<br />Morse was an awesome Giant in the mold of Burrell, but he's made for the AL playing DH with a handful of 1B days thrown in.<br />Vogelsong isn't a hot commodity. Wait for pitching market to unfold, see what's available and know he's an option if we need it. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-7220835132578052532014-11-03T21:30:40.571-08:002014-11-03T21:30:40.571-08:00Yes, the age factor is a huge consideration, as we...Yes, the age factor is a huge consideration, as well as the fact that the potential replacements for Panda don't quite match up offensively or defensively. Others have mentioned we can replace Panda with some kind of offensive-defensive platoon, but the truth is that would entail two different players staying healthy and performing up to expectations. And "replacing" Panda's offensive production by shoring up other areas is not ideal either... signing Panda to a reasonable contract would not preclude addressing those other areas of weakness since I am sure the 3rd WS title has provided at least a modest revenue boost. I hope Panda can have a heart to heart talk with fellow players who have been in his situation as a beloved fan favorite who moved on. Reading between the lines of Pujols' interviews since leaving the Cardinals suggest that he really misses St. Louis and regrets leaving and that it was his perceived "poor handling" by management that was the only reason he left. If the Giants and Panda can work things out amicably both sides can hopefully avoid a painful parting of ways that would really be a lose-lose situation for both parties.baseballjunkienoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-65972423844053469002014-11-03T20:59:27.436-08:002014-11-03T20:59:27.436-08:00Thanks for the update, Roger. Sounds like Peavy i...Thanks for the update, Roger. Sounds like Peavy is gone unless the Giants are willing to go 2+ years. Seems like he enjoyed being a Giant, but he now has two WS rings with his last two teams after joining them mid-season. Despite Bochy being here I'm not sure he was here long enough to feel ingrained as a Giant, and his poor post-season performance certainly didn't help things either from his perspective or the team's. Romo is likely gone too, since the Giants have always shown skill in finding useful bullpen arms at a bargain. Had he not lost the closer's job there might be more incentive on both sides to keep them together for 2015. Morse was a good Giant when it counted most, and a great clubhouse guy, but alas, he and the Giants both realize his best fit is in the AL. So that leaves Vogey. I just have a feeling he comes back for one more year at a reasonable cost, slots in as the #4 or #5 starter, gives it his best shot for a strong season, then hangs it up. Oh, and I am pretty sure the Giants and Panda work things out, allowing him to keep playing with the team and city he loves, and pleasing his large fanbase. Not sure if I am thinking more with my heart than my head and purely as a fan rather than objectively, but that is my gut feeling on each of these players.baseballjunkienoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-15688587314337320392014-11-03T18:58:24.950-08:002014-11-03T18:58:24.950-08:00I like the idea of overpaying a bit on the average...I like the idea of overpaying a bit on the average salary and keeping the contract to 3 years. 51 to 60 million over 3 years. RBJnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-52557529842904013202014-11-03T18:22:12.336-08:002014-11-03T18:22:12.336-08:00Pujols was age 32, the Panda age 28, and we don...Pujols was age 32, the Panda age 28, and we don't have Matt Adams waiting at 3B. <br /><br />Duffy's arm looks like a slingshot from SS, we need a cannon from 3B. <br /><br />I have no problem with post season heroes. Monterey Sharkhttp://www.eollinger.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-65608577497543951842014-11-03T17:37:57.916-08:002014-11-03T17:37:57.916-08:00No upside on Valbuena. In fact, I would say he is...No upside on Valbuena. In fact, I would say he is a pretty good bet to regress.DrBGiantsfanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10699322384438591979noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-9473545527810283582014-11-03T17:23:16.771-08:002014-11-03T17:23:16.771-08:00Pence earned "the pence" because he'...Pence earned "the pence" because he's a workout freak who plays 155+ games a year. Panda, while being a post season hero, just hasn't shown that level of discipline outside of a contract year. I play Duffy at third before I risk that kind of cash. The Cards have shown that its not the end of the world when a franchise icon leaves. Sometimes you have to let go.mistglnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7389427040394111033.post-40643651400076259572014-11-03T14:38:02.724-08:002014-11-03T14:38:02.724-08:00You are completely right!! I forgot. I just read B...You are completely right!! I forgot. I just read Baggarly's tweet and thought about it but you are correct.<br /><br />Andrew Baggarly @CSNBaggs · 1h 1 hour ago<br /><br />#SFGiants have made a $15.3 million qualifying offer to Pablo Sandoval, I'm told. They did not offer on Peavy, Vogelsong, Romo or Morse.Rogernoreply@blogger.com